Now I bet most people don't know this...

I agree,most people don't know this. But there's also a law that most people don't know that makes it illegal for US politicians to accept foreign help to win an election. So if the Justice Dept wanted to talk to the Ukraine cops about possible illegalities by Joe Biden's son, or Trump's family stuff, or anyone else, that's OK. But when a US president asks the Ukraine pres to do him a favor and see if he can dig up any dirt on the Bidens, that's clearly a political request and clearly illegal. Even if Trump didn't mean it the way it sounded, he had no business talking to the Ukraine pres like that. If there was any reason to suspect criminal activity in the Ukraine by a US citizen, it should have been cops talking to cops, and the Ukrainian cops should have been the ones initiating an investigation. That's the ONLY legal channel. And, so far as I know, there has never been any evidence about Biden's son doing anything illegal in the Ukraine.

Trump's son dodged a bullet in 2016 when he met with a Russian who claimed to have dirt on Clinton. Supposedly the meeting was a bust and no dirt was produced, so the son said nothing illegal had been done. But if he had accepted any political info from a Russian, that would have been illegal. So his defense was basically, we went to rob the bank, but it was closed for a holiday so we didn't rob it. No harm, no foul. LOL

Hi Fred:

Almost forgot-- please point me to the exact phrase in the transcript where the 2020 election was mentioned. They were discussing the 2016 election.

Now it seems to me that Trump has every right to investigate the 2016 hoax which was an attempted coup.

By the way once the document was changed allowing "hearsay" -- do you really think any sane person would fall for this as being anything other than yet another bullshit attempt by the Democrats to stage a coup attempt?

They are desperate. All of their conniving is going to be exposed. I guess it seems worth the risk at this point. The penalty for treason as far as I know is still death.

-- Debutante

Hi Fred:

That's very well documented research by Solomon. You calling it propaganda doesn't invalidate it.

Hillary's sycophants have been whining like two year olds ever since Trump won and stopped the transformation of the United States into a communist country.

Now I never had a problem with Hillary until after the election. Frankly, I am bewildered how anyone raised in Illinois can go off track to the extent that she's reputed to have done. Things around here are not as outrageous as the coasts.

Schiffty and his cohorts aren't fooling anyone. Nobody buys this bullshit that fake news is peddling. Nobody listens to the media anymore and nobody cares what Hollywood thinks either. We have our own news sources now.

The Democrats seem to think that nobody has a right to investigate them. They are sadly mistaken.

The origins of the 2016 hoax are going to come out no matter how hard the Democrats try to stop it. And the penalty for treason hasn't changed as far as I know.



-- Debutante

Hi Fred:

Because they didn't stop after he won.

They lied to get the FISA warrants and even AFTER Trump was elected and assumed office they CONTINUED with their "insurance policy coup". That is what makes it treason.

Insofar as this thing with Biden, I could give a rat's ass about him. In my opinion, it's ludicrous to think Trump would need political dirt on him. Not to be unkind, but Biden is senile. There's no way in hell he would have won anyway. It's absurd to even suggest it was a reasonable possibility. There wasn't a single day he spoke that he didn't have a "senior moment".

Look -- when things get that fuzzy -- he should stay home and pet the dog. He simply isn't focused enough to fill any government position.

If you ask me, what I really think happened is that the Democrats themselves wanted Biden out of the race so they're trying to kill two birds with one stone. By trying to make a nothing phone call into a big deal enough dirt surfaced on Biden to give Warren the lead.

Did Biden's son made out like a bandit in the Ukraine and China? He probably did. Both Solomon and Guiliani have documentation that indicates he did.

And no...I do not take the word of the European Union as to "what happened" in the Ukraine as being anything other than bullshit. I don't like them. I don't trust them. And I will be glad when the UK gets free of them and I hope other countries follow suit. Anyone who believes or trusts the EU needs their head examined. And Soros is already banned in six countries. They should ban him from the planet.

Oh and it is awfully convenient for Bernie to need stents at this point in time.

Edited to add:

Just thought I'd throw in this article that lists all the ways this Ukrainian hoax is falling apart.

www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/03/nolte-11-facts-that-have-already-unraveled-the-ukraine-hoax/

--Debutante

Hi Fred:

That's just plain silly. Up until the last moment Hillary was "supposed" to win according to the mockingbird media polls. Well, she didn't. Do you really think any sane person listens to those stupid polls anymore?

The mockingbird media is broken. Nobody cares. There is an entire digital army gathering information and putting it out there for public view and there is NOTHING the Clowns In America can do about it.

Trump has thousands of people at his rallies and more clamouring to get in because there is never enough room no matter the size of the venue. The Democratic candidates are lucky to pull a crowd of a few hundred.

Democrats just don't get it. We the people love President Trump. It's only the commies and globalist puppets who don't.

Insofar as the investigation of corruption, what you're really trying to say is that if someone who is a Democrat wants to commit a crime and get away with it -- all they have to do is run for President.

Do you really think the electorate is that stupid?

The Democrats are covering their ass by claiming "election interference" because they don't want their corruption exposed. Funny how they didn't consider it "election interference" when they concocted the Russia hoax and investigated Trump for two years.

There was an old tv show that had the following catchphrase: "If you can't do the time, then don't do the crime." Democrats would do well to remember that.


--Debutante

Hi Fred:

Here's the thing. I wouldn't believe the Mainstream media if the stood on a stack of bibles. They're "fake news". The digital army tells the truth but you prefer to listen to what you want to hear.

Russia Russia was nothing but a hoax. Those seventeen agencies you're talking about were actually weaponized during the last 3 weeks of Obama's administration for the sole purpose of framing Trump. Why werent those seventeen agencies privy to those avenues of information during Obama's entire administration? Because he only did it when the "insurance policy" of the dirty dossier was launched by the Clowns In America. There is a reason JFK said he wanted to break it into pieces and scatter it to the four winds.

There is ample evidence this was an attempted coup. Because you choose not to believe it, doesn't invalidate the evidence.

We're not going to agree on this. I know the Democrats are traitors, and you think they're not. No matter how much evidence there is; you will never believe it because you don't want to believe it.

I imagine when they hang these traitors or toss their sorry butts in jail you still won't believe it.

Trump is the first president that has ever done anything for the people. I'm glad he won. And I am glad he will win in 2020. (Let's just say I know for the same reason I knew last time).

To be blunt, I didn't work hard all my life to have a dingbat like AOC and her ilk "socialize" my country and empty my bank account for their pet projects. And I can pretty well guess most sane Americans feel the same way.

If these idiots want socialism, let them pack their bags and move to a socialist country like Venezuela.

I like the fact that we are a constitutional republic and thank God we have Donald Trump!

Edited to add:

americaoutloud.com/indictments-are-coming-for-obama-officials-who-executed-the-coup-against-trump/

--Debutante

Hi Fred:

Oh, Norway isn't all that great. They average 21 rapes a night since the the migrants arrived. But shhh.....nobody is supposed to know that.

And the medicine in those countries is great (as long as you don't get sick).

Case in point on the medical front ...Rev is very ill and last I spoke to him -- he was singing the praises of socialized medicine.

Well, I haven't spoken to him in a year because he will not survive this illness. He prefers to face things alone --always did. Thing is...he THINKS he is getting quality care .

I know what he has and I know what the standard is for this problem. If he came home and was treated here -- he'd have more time. For all I know, they might have killed him already with their substandard approach to the problem.

People who think socialized medicine is good believe so because they don't know enough to see where the corners were cut.

But for his complete stubbornness in preferring Europe (for reasons that have nothing to do with this issue) he's get better care here. They cut corners from the get go and greatly reduced his chances.

So don't think socialized anything is worth much-- it is substandard. I know what they did and more importantly what they didn't do.

But getting back to the coup-- the reports will be out soon and we'll see then.

--Debutante

Forgot to mention the "coup". First off, a coup is taking over a government by force, usually military, not by dirty tricks, impeachment, etc. That means the entire government. Secondly, right now, the Reps have the Presidency, the Senate, and the Supreme Court. If Trump leaves, the Reps will have the Presidency (Pence), the Senate, and the Supreme Court. In other words, it's a piss-poor coup if you don't actually take over the entire Federal government. In fact, the "coup" would still leave 3 out of the 4 Federal government entities in the hands of Reps. How would that help the evil Dems? It wouldn't at all. Much better to win the 2020 election and get the Pres and the Senate by votes. No need at all for a stupid and inefficient coup. Or, if they must have a coup, do one that actually gives the Dems power rather than one that changes nothing.

Anyway, because the Dems are not trying to take over the entire Federal gov or any part thereof by force, whatever they do in the way of investigations or impeachment is not legally a "coup" and therefore there will be no Dems in jail for their efforts. Like I said, the Reps and the right wing did exactly the same kind of stuff under Obama, as best they could, and no one ever called their efforts to remove or weaken him a coup attempt. Just nasty politics as usual. You can make up all the lies you want about a president and, at best, you might be sued for slander or libel. But lying about a president or a political party is not a felony, is not treason, and has never been punished.

>Have you totally missed the statements that if they can get rid of Trump, then Pence is next on their list?
---Who’s this “they” of which you speak. LOL Pence is totally safe. He hasn't said or done any of the illegal things that Trump has. And, as I often point out, many Republicans would like to dump Trump and keep Pence, so they may stab Trump in the back if they get the chance and can blame it on the Dems. (Ted Cruz chants every morning, “revenge is a dish best served cold.”) But Pence is more like a traditional Rep pres and he has a better chance of winning in 2020 than Trump. Even Fox News polls put Trump behind all of the top 5 Dems in Sep.

>Did you miss that weekend when Pelosi was going to "vacation" with a plane load of her relatives and Trump grounded the flight -- just as Donna Brazil's tweeted out an implied promotion for Nancy that day from "speaker to President"?
---I don't get it. How would flying somewhere be part of a coup? Where are the armed attackers? Doesn't make any sense. Why would she need an alibi? If she just wanted to be out of Washington, then rent a car or take a commercial flight somewhere. Again, it's a pretty pathetic coup if it can be so easily prevented. And, again, if a childish plan is the best the evil Dems can do, then they deserve to be laughed out of town.

---Trump is seriously obese and has secret health problems that he won’t admit. Sprinkle a little of this or that into his cheeseburger and off he goes to the hospital for several days of tests. Makes him look weak. Even a tab of LSD just before one of his campaign rallies so that he babbles (even more) could make him look even more foolish. Why all the complex and not-likely-to-succeed plans when there are plenty of cheap and simple ways to mess with him? As I said, realistically, he will not be removed from office by impeachment because the Reps control the Senate and they will not convict him.

---Right now the House is doing an “impeachment investigation”. This is not yet an actual impeachment (and probably never will be) and is in no way a danger to Trump as far as removal from office goes. Unless the Senate Reps turn on him. (Quite a few have actually openly complained about his deal with Turkey to screw our allies in Syria, but that's not enough. Yet.) The Dem’s hope is to keep Trump’s antics in the news during the summer of the 2020 election with investigations. Just like the Reps did with 3 Congressional investigations on Clinton and many wild claims of her various crimes that were never proved. (Remember Trump's promise to lock her up? How's that going?) That’s it. No coup needed, no impeachment (attempt to remove him from office). Just let him keep tweeting and spouting off his nonsense in public and the Dems will win the election. No muss, no fuss. Trump's mouth is his worst enemy.

That weekend was one of the attempts on Trump's life. Don't recall the exact details of that one -- there have been so many. What are we at now? Last count I saw tallied was 27.
---And yet I haven’t heard of even one. 8->

---Anybody can kill anybody so long as they don’t expect to survive. Trump is an easy target, since he spends so many hours per week playing golf at his own places, and, since there are paying guests at all of those places, it would be very easy to slip a killer in. But killing him would make him a martyr. Makes much more sense to expose him and get his base to turn on him. More difficult, but way more effective.

>We can use what we save on our own citizens
---Socialism!!! Anyway, you’re missing the financial parts of the equation. Like Republican Eisenhower warned, the military-industrial complex rules the national budget. Defense contractors bribe Congress to buy more military stuff, and Congress sends troops all over the world to justify their multi-billion-dollar spending on stuff we don’t need.

>I do not understand why Democrats seem to believe that everyone else, everywhere else, is much more important than America and its people.
---They don’t. But when they try to help Americans, they’re accused of being socialists.

---At any rate, when you’re playing the international politics game, it’s cheaper to help keep a friendly government in power by giving them aid than it is to deal with an anti-American revolution. Yes, there are some in the Republican Party who want to cut back on our overseas bases and such (the Rands and a couple of others), but most Republicans take the same bribes that the Dems do and are perfectly happy to keep our 400 (or whatever it is now) overseas bases active. And if we have a military base in a nation, we have to give them money. And probably their neighbors, too, just to help protect our bases.

---I agree with you that we could and should get rid of most of these overseas bases. But, like I said, that would be bad for corporations, so Congress will never allow it. Either party. The Reps had Congress for the last couple of years of Obama, but they never even tried to fix this problem. Same for the first 2.5 of Trump. Pulling the last 150 troops out of Syria is so puny that, aside from betraying a friend, it's not worth mentioning.

Impeachment
Here’s what’s happening. There’s a Federal law that prohibits a president from taking stuff from a foreign government. Trump asked Ukraine and China to help him break that law. This is much like someone going into a bar and asking if someone will sell him illegal drugs. But if no one sells him drugs, then nothing illegal happened. Same for Trump. General consensus is that Joe Biden is not guilty of any crimes and so Ukraine and China cannot help Trump break the law.

But he’s in trouble for asking them to break the law. Still, that’s not an impeachable offense. So what the Dems are doing is putting on a song-and-dance and dissing him for abuse of power. Very grey area, but not likely to result in impeachment. BTW, some of the tricks they are using against Trump are things the Reps put into place to get Bill Clinton, so much of this is the Reps own fault.

By whining and blustering about it all, Trump is making the minor problem worse. Current trend is that about 60% of the US favors the impeachment investigation, and those numbers keep rising as he rants and refuses to cooperate. But the odds are still very strong against an actual impeachment vote.

There’s a conservative group (Republicans for the Rule of Law) that plans to run on Fox ads this weekend urging House and Senate Republicans to openly condemn Trump (as many of them do in private).

“Republicans in Congress must condemn this behavior without reservation. It is no longer about whether Republicans believe President Trump or whether they support his policies. It’s about whether they support his admitted abuse of power and his efforts to secure a foreign government’s help in an American election. President Trump sees nothing wrong with his behavior. In fact, he’s proud of it. The question now is, are Republicans?” - Chris Truax

So it’s not just Dems in Congress that Trump has to worry about, but also conservative Reps. BTW, Republican Senator Ted Cruz says he supports the impeachment investigation. 8->

Hi Fred:

Just found this little tidbit! Naughty, naughty whistleblower leaving this out if his "report"!

www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/10/sorry-democrats-its-over-john-solomon-drops-bomb-info-omitted-from-whistleblower-report-ukraine-was-re-opening-probe-into-hunter-bidens-company-in-february/






Lol!

--Debutante

>He has every right to ask for an investigation of corruption It's part of the treaty.
---Like I said before, that’s a cop-to-cop thing. Something politicians should not be involved with. And Trump didn’t ask for an investigation of corruption that included the many Republicans wheeling and dealing over there, he asked for an investigation of a particular person, a political foe, just before an election. Not proper police work.

>If someone wants to commit a crime and get away with it all they have to do is declare that they are running for president for the Democratic nomination.
---Not at all. The police can investigate anyone they think needs it. But it looks bad to wait a 2-3 years after the fact, until an election is coming and then ONLY investigate your political foes and not the members of your own family or party that may have committed crimes. If the Bidens did something back when Joe was in office, why is an investigation only needed now? Trump’s been in office for about 2.5 years. The timing sucks.

>So what you're really saying is that you think it is okay that Biden's son was probably getting a payoff for his Dad's influence and it's okay that Biden stopped the investigation by threatening to withold aid money...
---Nope, what I’m saying is that it’s wrong for the president to target his political foes and ignore the members of his own family and party. Keep in mind that Jared is working a on $100 million dollar deal with Saudi Arabia, based on his influence with Trump, Ivanka is doing the same in China, and Trump has two towers in Turkey, several Russians invested hundreds of million in Trump businesses in 2016, etc. Hey, if any Biden broke the law, let’s get them. But if Trump and his family are actually doing worse, and they are, let’s get them, too.

>I keep telling you not to read "fake news". You end up missing all the good stuff!
---And I keep telling you the same thing. Ii spend a lot of time tracking down and verifying stories, for my own amusement, and I promise you that the stuff from the far right is as fake as anything out there.

>plus for the past two years he's had to defend himself against the Russia hoax.
---He didn't do anything except send out Tweets and attack everyone. Required almost no time or effort since he just made stuff up and didn't spend any time doing research.

>The Democrats (seeing as they do nothing at all in terms of actual work for the people)
---Of course, Trump is SO much better, skipping all his briefings, not reading reports, watching TV 6 hours a day and playing golf almost every weekend. Actually, the Dems in the House have passed several pieces of legislation, but Moscow Mitch refuses to put any of them up for a vote in the Senate. It's the "do nothing" Reps you should be yelling at. Trump has issued dozens of executive orders, but what has the Republican Senate done lately?

>Now if I were Trump, I would ask the Democrats on camera why they think the President of the Ukraine is lying and embarrass the crap out of them.
---No embarrassment. Easy answer. Trump is still holding a gun to his head. Trump can stop the aid any time he to, so the Ukraine pres doesn't dare piss him off.

---The original transcript that the White House released contained enough evidence to start the investigation. Nothing else required. But remember that a transcript is whatever they want it to be. The WH could have left stuff out, changed the wording, etc. It's just words on paper. The stuff the WH DID release was enough to show that Trump asked the Ukraine pres to help him break Federal law. And there are people who heard the entire conversation and who have more to add. Anyway, like I say, so long as the Reps control the Senate Trump cannot be removed from office for his many crimes and abuses. Although I found it pretty funny that Trump turned on Fox News because they have a poll that shows 51% of Americans now favor removing him. Made Trump very angry. Not Dems, Fox Our-Middle-Name-Is-Republican News. LOL

---And now the military is turning on him for abandoning the Kurds. Even Congressional Republicans are publicly calling it a major mistake. We could have pulled US troops out of Syria without turning the Kurds over to the Turks. True, the Kurds didn't help the US during D-Day. But Trump didn't help the US during Vietnam. Isn't that the same? 8->

---As to an international incident for calling the Ukraine pres a liar, consider how many times Trump has attacked heads of state that are our friends and allies over the past years. One incident by the Dems cannot compete with 50 incidents by Trump. He's only nice to Putin, Saudi Arabia and North Korea. Everyone else he publicly trashes.

>Imagine stepping into a job wherein the past occupant of the post deliberately planted a minefield (figuratively speaking) to attempt to derail the very agenda the PEOPLE elected you to implement -- to put America first.
---First off, Trump was elected by only about 25% of possible voters, and his ratings have gone down since then, so he does not now and never did represent the majority of us. Second, all presidents since forever have had the same problem with civil service folk who stay in the same jobs for decades while presidents and parties pass through. Nothing different about this time round.

---Once more, it’s only a coup if they use force. Using politics and dirty tricks to mess with a foe is just “business as usual”. The Reps did exactly the same thing under Obama. Trump’s attempts to remove Obama (because the Reps couldn’t stand it that they lost the election? LOL) would put him high on the list of traitors, if that’s all it took. And, in fact, many of the things the Dems are doing now are things that the Reps set up when they had power and were after Bill Clinton. 8->

> That video should go viral because it's a perfect example of why the left are dangerous. They want to take away the right of free speech and worse yet, they feel justified in violating other people's rights.
---As I often state, I disagree with both liberal and conservatives. I see conservatives doing the same sort of things, just with different subjects. Remember the Trump promise to make everyone say “Merry Christmas” instead of ‘Happy Holidays”? Still waiting. Fox News goes on a rant every Dec and claims that the left is attacking Christmas because stores use Holidays instead of Christmas. And there was that flare up over the Starbuck’s Christmas coffee cups one year. Just as silly as the worst liberal. It violates religious freedom to make a baker do a gay wedding cake, but it’s OK to make Walmart employees say ‘Merry Christmas”. LOL

> This phone call with the Ukrainian President is bullshit.
---Nope, the pres clearly asked a foreign leader to aid him in breaking a Federal law. Good, solid stuff. As I say, Trump won’t be removed from office because of it, but it does demonstrate once again his lack of skill in international politics. And the thing with the Kurds has riled both the military and Republican leaders. He’s just a doofus. Again, his worst enemy is not the left, it’s his own mouth. If he’d just shut up and listen to experienced advisers, 99% of his problems would go away. But I believe he likes the reality show aspects of his management style and prefers chaos and yelling over actually getting work done.

> I personally can't wait for the 18th to arrive.
---And if the 18th comes and goes and nothing happens? What the Dems have done is not legally a coup attempt and they’ve done nothing that the Reps haven’t done in the past. Now I would be happy to see the leaders of both parties locked up or at least kicked out of office for accepting bribes and all that, but I’m not holding my breath. There’s nothing the Reps can do to the Dems because they literally have done exactly the same things and they can’t prosecute the Dems without exposing themselves to prosecution for the same things. And again, it's not illegal to mess with your foes. Nixon had to leave because he covered up the felonies that his staff did (burglaries), not because he was seeking political dirt on his foes. And the majority of Republicans still supported him, even after all the nasty bits were exposed.