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Post by debutante on Jun 20, 2019 18:54:21 GMT -5
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Post by faskew on Jun 21, 2019 7:33:54 GMT -5
Nothing new. People always blame their victims. The classic rape defense is "she was asking for it" because of the way the woman dressed or acted. Anyway, this guy didn't turn bad overnight just because of reparations talk. Easy test. About 12% of the US population is black, maybe 42 million or so. How many were law-abiding citizens until the reparations talk began and then suddenly turned violent? 1 out of 42 million is not a trend. 8->
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Post by debutante on Jun 21, 2019 9:32:05 GMT -5
Hi Fred:
Ah! But a case can be made that the Democrats focus on "reparations" incited him to act. Certainly, his explanation of "payment for slavery" points to that particular narrative.
Now of course, one could postulate he would have done this crime anyway and this is just an excuse -- but I am going to take the fellow at his word.
The point here being that if you keep stirring the pot to get "identity politics" to achieve a certain goal (make people angry and feel they are owed something) -- it should be no surprise when that "something" veers off into other areas.
I'm afraid the Democrats are going to have to own this result of their ill considered whipping up of racial tensions to make demands. But one hardly expects different from the "gimmedat" party.
They made the problem. They own it.
--Debutante
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2019 11:51:00 GMT -5
The slaves are getting uppity! Quick, don the hood!
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 21, 2019 12:59:27 GMT -5
The slaves are getting uppity! Quick, don the hood!
Exactly how does a violent assault and rape mean that "the slaves are getting uppity"?
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2019 19:25:05 GMT -5
They are taking white women! Lynch them!
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 21, 2019 20:58:45 GMT -5
They are taking white women! Lynch them!
Who exactly is claiming that anyone should be "Lynched?"
So far, you are the only one who's brought it up.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2019 23:39:18 GMT -5
Of course I brought it up, I am a correct believer who wants to protect our women from all the rape caused by saying that Blacks were mistreated!
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 22, 2019 2:04:34 GMT -5
Of course I brought it up, I am a correct believer who wants to protect our women from all the rape caused by saying that Blacks were mistreated!
And this is relevant to the case of a white woman who was raped by a black man who claimed the beating and rape he dished out was as revenge for slavery because...?
This is from the article: "“She was a white girl. She deserved it because us minorities have been through slavery,” Temar Bishop, 23, allegedly said to someone who witnessed the bloodied 20-year-old woman after the assaults, according to a criminal complaint.
“This is what they used to do to us. This is what they did to us during slavery. They used to beat us and whip us.”"
Bob
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Post by faskew on Jun 22, 2019 7:14:21 GMT -5
>The point here being that if you keep stirring the pot to get "identity politics" to achieve a certain goal (make people angry and feel they are owed something) -- it should be no surprise when that "something" veers off into other areas.
---You mean like when Trump stirred up all the Rust Belt folk against the elitist snobs or stirred up the White Supremacists against minorities, etc.? Lots of Muslims and Jews attacked so the WS folk can take back what's owed to them (being superior by birth). And so on.
---Reparations has been a subject for a long time, off and on. And it takes many forms. The coal miners in Appalachia were promised their jobs back, jobs that were lost due to shifts in technology and economics, factors which the government can't change. Why? Because they were "owed" those jobs. And their anger and frustration was harvested to get their votes.
---It's the way politicians work these days. Got to make people afraid and/or angry to get the votes. Then, if the extremists turn violent, the politicians disavow the message. But for both the left and the right, it's always someone else's fault.
---But like I said, if only 1 black guy out of about 42 million is stirred to violence by reparations talk, that's not enough to be concerned about or to blame anyone for. (For the record, I think reparations is nonsense and there is no realist way to make it happen, so, indeed, all the talk about it is mere politics.)
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Post by debutante on Jun 22, 2019 7:19:13 GMT -5
Bob,
Paraphilic disorders are being "defended" under the guise of "attacking racism".
Check the DSM-5 for classification of all acts falling into the parameters.Then decide if this argument is worth your time and effort.
Note: "Master/Slave" fantasy played out by perpetrator plus "Forcing unwilling partner". (Unfortunately, both given "justification" in his mind by recent Democratic emphasis on "being owed" for ancestral slavery.)
--Debutante
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Post by debutante on Jun 22, 2019 8:06:48 GMT -5
Hi Fred:
In what way did Trump "stir up" people with the phrase "Make America Great Again"?
To me, that statement immediately calls to mind the "can do" spirit of the WW2 generation who (after Pearl Harbor) rose from a crushing blow like a proverbial pheonix to work as one for victory. That, my friend -- is America being "great".
The suggestion that the phrase is a call to a racist past is a Democratic "wet dream" to put it bluntly. It was such a powerful message that they just had to try to tarnish it with their typical "rayciss" baloney.
"Making America Great" is a far cry from "You, who have never been enslaved, are owed something by people who never did anything to you, because people in the distant past ( about 1%) not remotely related to the majority of living white Americans, did something to black people more than a hundred fifty plus years ago."
Get serious, Fred. You have to do a hell of a lot of psychological projection to get "racism" out of "Make America Great Again". But the mainstream media (an arm of the Democratic party) pushed the narrative (along with the Russian hoax) to discredit Trump.
Judging by the size of his rallies, I don't think the Democratic strategy worked.
Let's be realistic here. Trump's emphasis on job creation was not a racial issue. There is now the lowest level of black unemployment in the history of our nation.
As to it being one case -- it is one case so far. Can you assure us, with absolute certainty that similar thoughts are not festering elsewhere in someone's mind just needing a little incitement in the form of being "owed" to bring them to fruitition?
The Democrats are playing a dangerous game and they don't give a damn. They just want power whatever way they can get it.
And I agree that they are wasting their time with reparations talk. It is impossible, but it stirs up anger in unbalanced people and they need to stop.
--Debutante
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2019 11:20:33 GMT -5
Of course I brought it up, I am a correct believer who wants to protect our women from all the rape caused by saying that Blacks were mistreated! And this is relevant to the case of a white woman who was raped by a black man who claimed the beating and rape he dished out was as revenge for slavery because...? Ah! But a case can be made that the Democrats focus on "reparations" incited him to act. Certainly, his explanation of "payment for slavery" points to that particular narrative. Those people need to get lynched like in the good old days!
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 22, 2019 11:54:22 GMT -5
And this is relevant to the case of a white woman who was raped by a black man who claimed the beating and rape he dished out was as revenge for slavery because...? Ah! But a case can be made that the Democrats focus on "reparations" incited him to act. Certainly, his explanation of "payment for slavery" points to that particular narrative. Those people need to get lynched like in the good old days!
Where in the original does it mention or even imply lynching? It doesn't.
So why did you bring that up?
Bob
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Post by debutante on Jun 22, 2019 12:58:10 GMT -5
Bob,
..he leaves so many openings, it's positively irresistable.
Because if there isn't any lynching, you can always make one up.
Just ask Jussie Smollett!
Sorry to interrupt! Carry on.
-- Debutante
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2019 15:10:54 GMT -5
Who said anything about lynching? Just pointing out that I am against rapists.
By the way, you got a rapist in your White House, America.
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Post by debutante on Jun 22, 2019 15:48:39 GMT -5
So many openings!!!!!
Past tense:
January 20, 1993 – January 20, 2001
ROFLMAO
--Debutante
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2019 18:33:01 GMT -5
I thought you were going to ignore me, Debbie dearest?
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Post by debutante on Jun 22, 2019 18:56:53 GMT -5
Then stop giving irresistible openings!
You're really minor league at this kind of thing -- anyone could drive a mack truck through them.
Putting you back on ignore (unless you do it again)... ROFLMAO
--Debutante
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 22, 2019 22:36:52 GMT -5
Who said anything about lynching? Just pointing out that I am against rapists. By the way, you got a rapist in your White House, America.
Does that mean you are finally against child marriages in Muslim countries?
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2019 7:18:06 GMT -5
Did you finally stop beating your wife?
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Post by faskew on Jun 23, 2019 8:16:46 GMT -5
> In what way did Trump "stir up" people with the phrase "Make America Great Again"? ---I agree that the slogan was not the problem. But it was his other statements that defined to the crazies what the slogan actually meant.
> Trump's emphasis on job creation was not a racial issue. There is now the lowest level of black unemployment in the history of our nation. ---Agreed. Except that Trump rode in on the back of the Obama economy, which was already great and had the low unemployment numbers that Trump now takes credit for.
---Trump promised that he was going to bring back factory and mining jobs. But he didn’t. Because, like the Bruce Springsteen song says, “those jobs are gone for good.” Through his tweets and other statements, he blamed illegal aliens for most of our job problems. And, of course, the Democrats, minorities, liberals, and just about anyone else except the people who had actually been in national power since 2012 – the Republicans. The Republican Party held most state legislatures, Congress, and many other sources of political power, yet somehow they managed to convince the public that it was the Dems who were ruining the country. LOL
---And the lie still holds power. During Trump’s first 2 years the Republicans had most states, both houses of Congress, the Supreme Court, and the Presidency, yet, somehow the Dems alone were magically responsible for ALL our problems. The Dems only wish they had as much power and influence as the Reps claim for them.
---Anyway, Trump used phrases that are common among White Supremist groups (“dog whistles”, probably put in by Steve Bannon), to indicate that he would put white males back in power again. After he was elected the WS, Nazis, Klansmen, etc. all celebrated and announced on their web sites that America was about to clean out the darkies under Trump’s leadership. Because that’s what MAGA means to them – white males in power. And the level of racial and ethnic violence jumped in the following months. Trump hasn’t overtly proclaimed White Power, but many of his people are whispering it behind the scenes to the extremists and crazies and they are praying and hoping that he will come through for them. Or that's what they say on their public sites.
>The Democrats are playing a dangerous game and they don't give a damn. They just want power whatever way they can get it. ---Indeed. As do the Republicans. Trump even admitted on TV that he would do whatever it takes to win the 2020 election. No restrictions – whatever it takes. How many Republicans publicly objected to that?
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Post by debutante on Jun 23, 2019 10:56:52 GMT -5
Hi Fred: I'm going to answer your points over the course of the day because I won't be able to find a large block of time to do them all at once. Let's begin with this: > Trump's emphasis on job creation was not a racial issue. There is now the lowest level of black unemployment in the history of our nation. ---Agreed. Except that Trump rode in on the back of the Obama economy, which was already great and had the low unemployment numbers that Trump now takes credit for. Are we talking about the same Obama? The fellow in this video clip who is completely CLUELESS as to any path to improvement? This bumbling, ineffectual gentleman walking around claiming to have no "answers" and saying "nobody else would" is your idea of a person who created a terrific economy that Trump is taking credit for? In fact, Obama keeps saying, "what is he (meaning Trump) gonna do?" culminating in saying that "He'd need a magic wand." In this clip each of Obama's remarks is followed by a brief news announcement of Trump's triumphant winning response. But let's just take economists word for it. thehill.com/opinion/finance/368904-economists-agree-trump-not-obama-gets-credit-for-economy--Debutante
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Post by debutante on Jun 23, 2019 18:42:31 GMT -5
Hi Fred:
Re: Dog Whistles
I actually had to do some research on this topic, as I was unfamiliar with the term. I found quite a bit of information on them, some of which led me to believe the entire topic is nonsense.
This sentence alone should win a prize for absurdity:
The dog whistle metaphor suggests that the dogs — the intended audience — hear the message clearly. That’s wrong. The code is designed to hide the actual dynamics from the target audience itself,” Ian Haney-López, author of Dog Whistle Politics: How Coded Racial Appeals Have Reinvented Racism and Wrecked the Middle Class, told me.
On one hand we're to believe this "hidden message" causes the target audience to react in a frenzy. On the other hand, the target audience is so stupid they don't see the dynamics and realize they've heard this selfsame whistle that supposedly is driving them to act.
I have seldom seen a crock of shit presented as if it's something to profoundly consider.
In another article I read:
Dog whistle usually refers to the use of certain code words or phrases that are designed to be understood by only a small section of the populace.
At the same time, we are to believe these secret code words and phrases only understood by a small section of the populace are perfectly clear to the Democratic party -- so much so -- that they have to warn unsuspecting people about them! Yeah, right.
A third site spoke of them in a historic context -- as a seldom used political technique in modern times due to a more sophisticated populace.
The third site was the only one that made any sense of an otherwise stupid concept.
To be fair, I googled some supposed Trump "dog whistles".
For example, one listed was Trump referring to MS-13 gang members as "animals". A quick Internet search will bring up a sampling of their various publicized crimes. Trump's description was not inaccurate. Perhaps, only in the mind of a liberal, which as a group, shows very little in the way of common sense, ability to look at facts and see reality, or make a value judgment based on sane criteria.
In short, Fred --- unless you can come up with an exact quote that says something rather than something someone thinks says something -- I'm afraid this particular part of your argument is basically a lot of nothing.
--Debutante
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 23, 2019 19:38:51 GMT -5
Did you finally stop beating your wife?
That's a Complex Question Fallacy.
The question I asked you isn't. Are you against the child marriages that are permitted in Muslim countries?
And do you believe that child marriages are harmful in any society and in any historical period?
Bob
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Post by faskew on Jun 24, 2019 8:18:21 GMT -5
Deb -
>Are we talking about the same Obama? ---Sure. Read up on how bad the economy was when Obama took over from George W. and then how much better it was when he left. Trump inherited an up-and-running system that didn’t require him to do anything. But he keeps claiming credit for things that were working BEFORE he became president. Yes, the economy continued its upswing after Obama left. But all the pieces were in place before Trump came in. (And now there’s a chance that one of Trump’s stunts, like the China tariffs, the Mexican tariffs, or an attack on Iran, might mess the economy up again. Republican nightmare. But the US public only has a 6-week memory, so what’s going on in Oct a year and a half from now is the only thing that really will count in the election.)
Dog whistles – yeah, you can find all sorts of definitions and such out there. The left-wing sources see them in everything the right says and the right-wing sources claim that they don’t even exist at all. At its basic core, it just means that politicians can use certain words that their followers will understand in a different way than the general public does. No big secrets, just letting the base know that they are listennd to. Different from code words, but similar. Back in my youth the Dixiecrats used to refer to “state’s rights” as a code to mean legal segregation and discrimination. (It was the Dem Feds forcing desegregation on them that pushed them over to the Reps in 1968.) ---Like I said, I think that Bannon and some other far-right types got Trump to say things that he didn’t know were dog whistles. Like when Trump talked about an international banking conspiracy trying to take over the world (an old anti-Jewish claim), etc. And many far-right folk believe that the Jewish left is encouraging illegal immigration in order to destroy the American way of life. Lots of belief in various Jewish conspiracies among the WH staff.
---Trump himself only seems to be mildly anti-Jewish. Seems more confused than committed. But many of his staff and advisers are terrified of Jewish plots and see them everywhere. And yes, it’s possible to be both pro-Israel and anti-Jewish because the evangelicals believe that it’s necessary for Israel to exist to be part of the Apocalypse. But most of the Israelis will refuse to convert at that time and will be popped off straight to Hell. So the Jewish nation must be protected, for the sake of Jesus coming back, but the Jews themselves can and will literally go to Hell.
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Post by debutante on Jun 24, 2019 10:15:46 GMT -5
Hi Fred:
Re: dog whistle
Again, what someone imagines something might mean is a hell of a lot different than what was actually said. Basically,you're making a case that "dog whistles" exist because the Democrats think they do.
They, of course, would have no ulterior motivation for subscribing all sorts of dastardly "secret meanings" to benefit themselves, now would they?
Perhaps only low I.Q. voters (democrats) fall for it, because republicans are perfectly capable of not requiring "translation" of their native tongue.
There are several entertaining videos on You Tube wherein democrats are specifically asked to state one racist comment by Trump. They can't do it and dissolve in confusion. Why? Because they only think he said it because someone imagined there was this secret coded "dog whistle" in whatever Trump says.
Actually, "dog whistle" isn't the term you're looking for. It's psychological projection.
More later on Obama...
--Debutante
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Post by debutante on Jun 24, 2019 10:33:42 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2019 11:54:15 GMT -5
Hey Deb, are you against rape or do you support your rapist president?
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Post by rmarks1 on Jun 24, 2019 13:29:32 GMT -5
Hey Deb, are you against rape or do you support your rapist president?
You're missing some information here. Exactly when was the president arrested, tried, and convicted of rape?
Bob
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