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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 18, 2019 14:11:46 GMT -5
Well at least they had Free Education and Free Health Care.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2019 19:01:52 GMT -5
Cuba is the only country in the world with free education and public healthcare, and look what a mess that has made out of the country!
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 18, 2019 19:54:50 GMT -5
Cuba is the only country in the world with free education and public healthcare, and look what a mess that has made out of the country!
I would really like to see the logical process that led you to that conclusion.
It's the tyrannical Communist system that made Cuba a mess. That's why thousands of people risked death to leave.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2019 23:06:10 GMT -5
Cuba is the only country in the world with free education and public healthcare, and look what a mess that has made out of the country! I would really like to see the logical process that led you to that conclusion.
It's the tyrannical Communist system that made Cuba a mess. That's why thousands of people risked death to leave.
Bob
So you agree that this has nothing to do with free education and free healthcare? |
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 18, 2019 23:27:54 GMT -5
I would really like to see the logical process that led you to that conclusion.
It's the tyrannical Communist system that made Cuba a mess. That's why thousands of people risked death to leave.
Bob
So you agree that this has nothing to do with free education and free healthcare?
In a way it does. Supporters of the Dictatorial Cuban regime tend to mention those as if they were somehow justification for the tyranny and the poverty.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2019 23:56:24 GMT -5
That's not what's written in the article you posted.
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 19, 2019 0:39:54 GMT -5
That's not what's written in the article you posted.
Sure it is. The author keeps saying that no matter how hard he complained, he always seemed to get the answer that at least he had free education and medical care.
Bob
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Post by faskew on Apr 20, 2019 8:17:45 GMT -5
Actually, except for sharing with siblings and neighbors, that description of life in Cuba is very similar to my own childhood growing up in the right-wing super-capitalist Panhandle of Texas in the Golden Economic Days of the 1950s. Several people in that rural town lived in two-room tar-paper shacks, one room where the entire family slept and the other a kitchen without running water. Outhouses and storm shelters in the back. All with working fathers but not enough pay to live on. And no matter how hard we complained, we were told that at least we didn't have to live under communism! Better dead that red. LOL
Socialism may indeed have a dark side, but so does capitalism.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2019 11:30:45 GMT -5
Therefore, you shouldn't want free education. Minnows don't get that kind of luxury.
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 20, 2019 11:51:11 GMT -5
Actually, except for sharing with siblings and neighbors, that description of life in Cuba is very similar to my own childhood growing up in the right-wing super-capitalist Panhandle of Texas in the Golden Economic Days of the 1950s. Several people in that rural town lived in two-room tar-paper shacks, one room where the entire family slept and the other a kitchen without running water. Outhouses and storm shelters in the back. All with working fathers but not enough pay to live on. And no matter how hard we complained, we were told that at least we didn't have to live under communism! Better dead that red. LOL Socialism may indeed have a dark side, but so does capitalism.
Bad as it was for you, you still had it better than the Cubans.
No one put you in jail for complaining and your family could have left anytime they wanted to without risking their lives. All you needed to buy something was money. You didn't have to ask permission from government officials.
Your family was imprisoned more by their fundamentalist Christian religion than by anything else.
Bob
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 20, 2019 11:58:20 GMT -5
Therefore, you shouldn't want free education. Minnows don't get that kind of luxury.
Non Sequitur. And Fred is a human, not a fish.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2019 13:10:56 GMT -5
Actually, except for sharing with siblings and neighbors, that description of life in Cuba is very similar to my own childhood growing up in the right-wing super-capitalist Panhandle of Texas in the Golden Economic Days of the 1950s. Several people in that rural town lived in two-room tar-paper shacks, one room where the entire family slept and the other a kitchen without running water. Outhouses and storm shelters in the back. All with working fathers but not enough pay to live on. And no matter how hard we complained, we were told that at least we didn't have to live under communism! Better dead that red. LOL Socialism may indeed have a dark side, but so does capitalism. Bad as it was for you, you still had it better than the Cubans. No one put you in jail for complaining Actually, plenty of civil rights activists during the 1960s landed in jail, including Martin Luther King Jr. himself. And during the 1950s, people who were of the "wrong" (i.e. leftist, socialist, anarchist) political ideology were persecuted as "communists". This was the height of the McCarthy era, after all. |
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Post by faskew on Apr 20, 2019 16:27:52 GMT -5
>Your family was imprisoned more by their fundamentalist Christian religion than by anything else.
And lack of money. Takes money to move.
Although the gov didn't impose censorship, the locals were not hesitant to use force on anyone they believed didn't have the correct thinking. 8-<
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 20, 2019 18:02:51 GMT -5
Bad as it was for you, you still had it better than the Cubans. No one put you in jail for complaining Actually, plenty of civil rights activists during the 1960s landed in jail, including Martin Luther King Jr. himself. And during the 1950s, people who were of the "wrong" (i.e. leftist, socialist, anarchist) political ideology were persecuted as "communists". This was the height of the McCarthy era, after all.
Those activists weren't just complaining. They were demonstrating. One of the purposes of those demonstrations was to publicize the movement. Demonstrations that were broken up by the police and the arrest of demonstrators were more likely to get media coverage. Perhaps the most famous of these took place at the Edmund Pettis Bridge in 1965. The violence of the police towards unarmed marchers who did not resist was covered on national television and stirred outrage across the entire country. This was instrumental in the passage of Civil Rights legislation shortly after. The Voting Rights Act was passed that August.
As far as the 1950's, yes people were persecuted. Some even went to prison. Of course it was nothing like the mass persecutions and executions in the Soviet Union and Mao's China. It was all over in just a few years.
Of course now we have leftist groups persecuting everyone who doesn't agree with them.
Bob
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Post by faskew on Apr 21, 2019 7:58:52 GMT -5
It's the nature of the True Believer, left or right. The foe is evil and must be stopped. It's self defense. And, of course, the more dangerous the foe is, the more money and power you get for fighting them. Sigh.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2019 9:51:24 GMT -5
Except that there are no "leftist groups" in the US government who would be persecuting dissenters, of course.
Much like "death panels" caused by public healthcare, and "socialist brainwashing" caused by public education, those exist solely in Bob's fever dream version of reality.
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 21, 2019 10:54:24 GMT -5
It's the nature of the True Believer, left or right. The foe is evil and must be stopped. It's self defense. And, of course, the more dangerous the foe is, the more money and power you get for fighting them. Sigh.
Unfortunately you're right Fred. And people never seem to learn. It's been happening in this country again and again at least as far back as the Salem Witch Trials.
Bob
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 21, 2019 10:59:20 GMT -5
Except that there are no "leftist groups" in the US government who would be persecuting dissenters, of course.
Much like "death panels" caused by public healthcare, and "socialist brainwashing" caused by public education, those exist solely in Bob's fever dream version of reality.
Ho hum. Another Ad Hominem. Run out of Facts again? 
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2019 16:17:09 GMT -5
Run out of Facts again? Yes, you're running out of facts and have to substitute them with your Randian nightmare fantasies. |
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 21, 2019 17:27:59 GMT -5
Run out of Facts again? Yes, you're running out of facts and have to substitute them with your Randian nightmare fantasies.
As usual, you give no Facts to back up your claims.
You know it would really help if you actually gave some examples of what I said and then gave some actual evidence that they are "nightmare fantasies." Otherwise it might appear that you are just making up unsubstantiated fairy tales.
I'm sure you have plenty of evidence for your views but you just didn't have the time to post it.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2019 0:35:16 GMT -5
I am simply pointing out that as long as you don't give some evidence to support your arguments, it appears that you are just making up unsubstantiated fairy tales.
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 22, 2019 9:44:45 GMT -5
I am simply pointing out that as long as you don't give some evidence to support your arguments, it appears that you are just making up unsubstantiated fairy tales.
Strange. I always try to give arguments to support my claims. Where did I fail to do so?
Please give me a quote where I gave an argument without evidence. Thank you.
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2019 11:19:03 GMT -5
I am simply pointing out that as long as you don't give some evidence to support your arguments, it appears that you are just making up unsubstantiated fairy tales. Strange. I always try to give arguments to support my claims. Where did I fail to do so? Please give me a quote where I gave an argument without evidence. Thank you. Bob
Here: |
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 22, 2019 13:59:26 GMT -5
Strange. I always try to give arguments to support my claims. Where did I fail to do so? Please give me a quote where I gave an argument without evidence. Thank you. Bob
Here:
But I gave that evidence in many previous posts. Here are just two of the many supporting links I gave:
"Vermont Students Protest Conservative Speaker, Assault Professor"
Protestors threaten Evergreen Professor
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2019 13:15:31 GMT -5
So two professors are literally everyone in America who disagrees with leftism?
No wonder America is teetering ever closer to a total Stalinist takeover when the entire rest of the population is supporting socialist tyranny.
Remember, this is the claim you have to support:
My emphasis.
You are painting a picture of large scale nationwide persecution of right-wingers and centrists in America. I would have expected that you would be able to come up with at least one serious article to support that claim |
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 23, 2019 14:21:54 GMT -5
So two professors are literally everyone in America who disagrees with leftism?
No wonder America is teetering ever closer to a total Stalinist takeover when the entire rest of the population is supporting socialist tyranny.
Remember, this is the claim you have to support:
My emphasis.
You are painting a picture of large scale nationwide persecution of right-wingers and centrists in America. I would have expected that you would be able to come up with at least one serious article to support that claim
Ho hum. I posted links to many articles over the last few years to support my claims. And you responded to most of those posts. Apparently you have a very bad memory.
But to make you happy, here is another link that shows the extent of the problem:
Bob
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2019 2:04:34 GMT -5
You posted "many articles" reporting that the majority of adult Americans is under persecution by leftists?
I must have missed those.
Can you perhaps elaborate on these mass persecutions of centrist and right-wing Americans?
How come you're still allowed to post here without issue, did they let you go because of your former Marxist credentials?
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Post by rmarks1 on Apr 24, 2019 16:35:08 GMT -5
You posted "many articles" reporting that the majority of adult Americans is under persecution by leftists?
I must have missed those.
Can you perhaps elaborate on these mass persecutions of centrist and right-wing Americans?
How come you're still allowed to post here without issue, did they let you go because of your former Marxist credentials?
As usual, you make up Strawman claims I never made.
It is not necessary for a majority of adult Americans to be under persecution to conclude that there is an increasing problem with persecution.
If all the Jews were under persecution, would you conclude that there is no problem because Jews are only a tiny part of the population and not a majority? By a similar "logic" would you conclude that there was never a problem with discrimination against Black people because, after all they are less than 20% of the total population?
If there is an increase in the number of incidents of persecution of Jews, or any other minority, would you conclude that there is no problem with persecution because a majority of the Jews have not suffered direct attacks?
And you don't have to have attacks on all college speakers to conclude the Freedom of Speech is in trouble. Attacks on just a few are enough for speakers to get the message.
Bob
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Post by debutante on Apr 25, 2019 17:00:53 GMT -5
Actually, except for sharing with siblings and neighbors, that description of life in Cuba is very similar to my own childhood growing up in the right-wing super-capitalist Panhandle of Texas in the Golden Economic Days of the 1950s. Several people in that rural town lived in two-room tar-paper shacks, one room where the entire family slept and the other a kitchen without running water. Outhouses and storm shelters in the back. All with working fathers but not enough pay to live on. And no matter how hard we complained, we were told that at least we didn't have to live under communism! Better dead that red. LOL Socialism may indeed have a dark side, but so does capitalism. Hi Fred: When I was a child, I didn't have any input into the way my parents ran our lives. What my Dad did for a living, where we lived, what my parents chose to spend their income on -- that wasn't anything that I (or my brother) had an option on which to cast a vote. So my parent's decisions set the tone for my early life. That's simply the way it was -- and I suspect is, for most children in every generation. So when you're discussing your "personal experience" in regard to capitalism -- you have to do so in relation to the choices your parents made. You lived in Texas. Could your parents have moved to another area and created another reality? In the capitalist system -- there is always a choice to change your circumstances (whatever they may be). Perhaps your parents had close family ties they didn't want to leave behind and that's why they stayed in an area which offered little opportunity. But the fact remains --- they did have an option to move elsewhere in the United States to a place which may have offered better opportunity. In a socialist state --everything is the same. So you have to leave Venezuela (for example) to change things. That is why the caravans are fleeing to a capitalist society -- because there is a capacity for change. No socialist society allows for upward mobility. --Debutante |
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Post by faskew on Apr 26, 2019 7:51:39 GMT -5
When you're at the bottom of the economic system, moving somewhere else doesn't fix the problem. My mother ran off when I was 9. My father had run away from home at age 14 and was functionally illiterate. He stayed where we were because he had old friends who let us live for free in abandoned buildings that they owned (plywood trailer house, abandoned labor barracks on a farm, etc.). If we had lived in an urban area, the government would have taken me away from him. But we lived in a very, very rural area. My father was also paranoid about the government and that, combined with his illiteracy, meant that he never tried to get welfare or any other government aid.
My father had several self-limiting habits and personality traits - like not bathing and dipping snuff. Things that would make it difficult to find a good job somewhere else. Plus, it costs money to move. Yes, the government doesn't restrict where you live, but economics does. It's even worse these days. If you want to rent an apartment you need first month's and last month's rent and a security deposit. Plus, getting utilities set up requires an installation fee. In other words, you need money to afford to move someplace where you can make money.
Again, my problems were not caused by the government. But capitalism as an economic system doesn't prevent or solve all problems. There are people, like me as a kid, who need a government to intervene with socialistic help. I didn't get much, but things like free public schools, school lunch programs, free vaccinations, etc., were great helps to me when pure capitalism and evangelical Christianity would have just let me die. 8-<
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