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Post by rmarks1 on Mar 26, 2018 16:44:25 GMT -5
There you have it. Conclusive proof!
Bob
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Post by raybar on Mar 26, 2018 17:54:21 GMT -5
The report indicates that, just before the crash, the woman told her children to buckle their seat belts. If she really believed that god would protect them, she should have insured that she and the children were not using their seat belts for this demonstration.
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Post by faskew on Mar 27, 2018 7:28:15 GMT -5
Ah, the evangelical mindset. I always get a laugh when I see people such people interviewed on TV after a disaster, like a tornado, who claim that God saved them because they prayed. No mention of the that those who died in the disaster also prayed. Or the idea that if God really cared about you, there wouldn't have been a tornado in the first place. LOL
But when I was such a kid in that life, the preachers had an out. If you tried to test God, that was an insult and showed a lack of faith. No testing allowed - just believe and keep sending in that money.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2018 16:45:04 GMT -5
I just love it when certain folks pick the weirdest of people to prove their point. Shall we try this with atheists, too?
"and I'm not afraid of burning in hell" shaking his symbolic fist at the symbolic man in the sky. Real mature.
But I understand. Yeah, Bob? Just sometimes it's hard to find some really good article on the internet to share here.
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Post by faskew on Mar 29, 2018 8:38:15 GMT -5
This is a good article. At least to me. I worry that people exactly like this women can end up in positions of power, whether government or business. I think it was back in Reagan's term when the head of the EPA announced that we didn't have to worry about pollution because God would take care of us. So dump all the toxic waste you want and pray, and everything will be fine.
Maybe it's because I grew up with these people. I don't know. But there are way too many of them in power for my sense of security. 8-<
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2018 11:20:34 GMT -5
I understand that, but it's irritating that it's a so a one-sided argument. I know that is what FACTS is or what it was created for, was to put down anything that looks like religion, supernatural, whatever. But it gets old. Especially from someone who insists that his version of voodoo prophecy is really scientific, but just can't prove it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2018 11:34:18 GMT -5
The report indicates that, just before the crash, the woman told her children to buckle their seat belts. If she really believed that god would protect them, she should have insured that she and the children were not using their seat belts for this demonstration. God told her to strap the kids into their seat belts, thus saving their lives. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2018 11:37:09 GMT -5
I understand that, but it's irritating that it's a so a one-sided argument. I know that is what FACTS is or what it was created for, was to put down anything that looks like religion, supernatural, whatever. But it gets old. Especially from someone who insists that his version of voodoo prophecy is really scientific, but just can't prove it. Yea, space rocks are no more or less likely to influence our behaviour than an invisible man in the sky. |
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Post by faskew on Mar 29, 2018 11:52:09 GMT -5
Lily - FACTS isn't based on putting down religion (or whatever). The original idea was to be skeptical. Which means not accepting anything (religion, politics, TV commercials, whatever) that doesn't have evidence to support it. And like the old saying goes, "Lack of proof is not proof of lack." There may indeed be some things that have no evidence now, but may in the future.
We are bombarded daily with claims that are not only unlikely to be true, but based on what we know of the world and how it works, cannot be true. The skeptic's job is to point out those things. Not to mock them, but to ask that belief or acceptance be withheld until such time as evidence for them is found.
Yeah, sometimes skeptics become bitter lash out. It's a crazy world and we're all in it together. So when people claim that prayer is the solution for a particular problem, it's difficult not to reply with an insult. When Ben Carson said that the pyramids in Egypt were storage bins for wheat that Joseph built (because that's his interpretation of the Bible), it certainly makes me want to rant about how could someone so educated be so ignorant of the basics of reality.
Thee basic creed of the skeptic is to follow the evidence wherever it leads. Even if you don't like where it takes you. The basic creed of most of the world is to ignore anything you don't like and only accept stuff that supports what you already believe. It's not easy to talk across this barrier.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2018 12:12:13 GMT -5
Fred, I realize that. And sometimes it just gets under my skin. It feels like a put down more than anything being that there's so few of us left posting which to me it changes the dynamics somewhat. I understand directing skepticism towards certain beliefs and believers that stretches the credibility to the extreme, but sometimes it seems like general put down.
See, the problem is that I learned skepticism from being on FACTS all these years, so my antenna for some things that seem out of whack to me has been sensitized.
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Post by faskew on Mar 31, 2018 8:07:35 GMT -5
People tend to want things in nice, tidy boxes. But life - biology, sociology, etc. - is fuzzy, and there are few sharp demarcations between things. It's the same problem for both extremes - those who believe everything and those who believe nothing. So for some skeptics ALL religion is equally silly. And for some religious folk, ALL skepticism is evil.
For example, I know a local evangelical woman who believes that all non-evangelical Christians are actually worshipers of Satan. They may not know if, but if they are not evangelical Christians, they support Satan. The Pope is a closet Satanist? You bet. And, yeah, there are skeptics who think that celebrating Easter is just as stupid as slitting the throat of a goat for a sacrifice.
But most folk, believers and skeptics alike, are somewhere in the middle. My goal as a skeptic has always been to encourage the moderates to help curb the crazies. Whatever the group, whether it's religion or politics or skeptics or whatever, the only people who can successfully deal with the extremists, are the moderates of that group. People are more likely to listen to those who those who have a similar world-view than they are to listen to outsiders. Especially when the outsiders begin the conversation with, "You people are ignorant/stupid/crazy/evil."
I have a nephew like that. He's a huge Trump supporter and constantly posts things on Facebook that attack liberals. Anyone says anything bad at all about Trump is a liberal, whether they know it or not. And you don't have to listen to anything liberals say because they're all ignorant snowflakes. He's also an evangelical, so his political world-view of us=good, them=evil is just a slight variation of that. Sigh.
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