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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2018 14:59:47 GMT -5
It seems to me that emotion and reason are intwined, with sometimes one and sometimes the other being experienced as coming first or being dominant. But there is a lot of activity below the level of conscious awareness, and I really have no idea what's happening there. I think the concept of Feedback is probably applicable here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feedback
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Post by rmarks1 on Feb 5, 2018 15:24:34 GMT -5
It seems to me that emotion and reason are intwined, with sometimes one and sometimes the other being experienced as coming first or being dominant. But there is a lot of activity below the level of conscious awareness, and I really have no idea what's happening there. I think the concept of Feedback is probably applicable here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FeedbackMmm. Could Feedback be applied to the problem of Free Will vs. Determinism? Bob
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Post by raybar on Feb 5, 2018 23:30:49 GMT -5
Yes, feedback is certainly part of what goes on, both consciously and unconsciously. But it seems far more complex than simple feedback, like sound going from a speaker back into a microphone and back out of the speaker and into the microphone and . . . Sometimes it seems as if " I " am a collection of sub personalities, or a group semi-autonomous modules. I sometimes find that I'm arguing with myself as if there are two or three of me, and each of us has his own ideas and goals and motivations and ways of acting.
Here's a real example of emotion and reason influencing each other, or working together - - - I saw a stick on the trail while I was hiking and I was going to kick it off the trail. But just as I approached, it moved. Whoa! I stopped dead in my tracks. That was an automatic unconscious reaction that happened so fast that I had frozen before I consciously realized the stick had moved. But what was that? It was neither emotion nor rationality. Too quick for either of those. But it put me into a state of caution (call it fear if you like). And that sort of fear (call it caution if you like) means: stop, careful, take another look at it. Then reason kicked in, and I took a closer look at the stick and saw that it was a snake. A little snake. No problem. And the fear subsided. But no!!! It's wasn't just any old snake, it was a rattlesnake. The fear returned, and this time it was saying: back off before you get bitten. So I took a step or two back and felt safe again.
Most of that was emotion (mild fear) and rationality (identify the threat and decide what to do). But first there was the "freezing in your tracks" reaction that began the episode. What was that? How does that work? I had stopped, or maybe even jumped back, before I was even aware that it was a snake and not a stick. The same reaction can happen if I unexpectedly encounter a little critter (insect, spider, millipede, scorpion). And it's not that I'm scared of them. I'm not. I jump back or yank my hand away before I even know that I've seen anything. Perhaps there exists something in our visual processing that can issue an emergency stop command the instant it spots a potential danger, before it's even finished processing the image. Perception (even half-processed perception) causes immediate action before I know anything is happening.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2018 12:33:44 GMT -5
The reason to make a promise cannot be emotional?
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Post by faskew on Feb 6, 2018 17:50:46 GMT -5
All animals have "instinct". It's what makes humans babies suckle and fear falling and such. We don't have to teach babies how to take in milk - just put something by their lips and they will suckle. Hard-wired. (And things like heart-beat and other body functions are run by the brain on automatic. Now and then "us" is aware of them, but mostly not.)
Sudden movement, loud noises, unusual sights, etc., all trigger a part of the brain that acts without thought or emotion. Smells can evoke deju vu memories, flavors remind us of other times, and so on.
The most important point to me is our brains are not separated into neat little boxes. Instinct, emotions, rational thought, etc. are all mixed together, like a soup, and different parts will bubble to the top now and then. Things are always happening in our brains, whether or not we're conscious. And just because we concentrate on something, like a book, doesn't mean that the brain isn't doing 20 other things at the same time. The part that we consider "us" has a limited awareness of everything that's going on.
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Post by rmarks1 on Feb 7, 2018 0:23:00 GMT -5
The reason to make a promise cannot be emotional? Yes it can. But that still does not change the reason promises had to be created. Promises and obligations are a method of insuring our behavior at some future point when our emotions may be telling us to behave differently. Bob
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2018 12:46:51 GMT -5
Okay, I get it. But it still doesn't guarantee that the promise won't be broken, and likely because of emotions as well.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2018 5:06:16 GMT -5
Yea. A promise is only that, a promise. It does not actually force a course of action. So whether we keep it or not does seem to depend on our motivation to keeping it and/or our emotional attachment to that promise.
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Post by rmarks1 on Feb 8, 2018 20:51:31 GMT -5
Yea. A promise is only that, a promise. It does not actually force a course of action. So whether we keep it or not does seem to depend on our motivation to keeping it and/or our emotional attachment to that promise. Promises do not determine a course of action. But they are a factor. If they weren't, then why have promises at all? Bob
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Post by rmarks1 on Feb 8, 2018 20:53:04 GMT -5
Okay, I get it. But it still doesn't guarantee that the promise won't be broken, and likely because of emotions as well. Right Lily. It is not a guarantee. But promises do affect our course of action. Otherwise, why have promises at all? Bob
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